Ambassador Kerim Uras’
interview has been published in the weekend (13-14 August) edition of Kathimerini.
Failed coup attempt in Turkey of 15 July, Turkish-Greek relations, Cyprus and
refugees issues have been covered in the interview. The English text of the interview is presented below:
Question: The authoritarianism, abuse of power, and Islamic nationalistic frenzy,
that some see in present day Turkey is creating a rift in its relationship
with the West.
Answer: These
are false impressions. Turkey has strong and unshakable bonds with the West.
Turkey is a founding member of the Council of Europe, a bastion of
democratic universal values and norms, along with human rights and the rule of
law, a negotiating candidate country for the EU and a staunch ally in NATO. There is and will not be any change
whatsoever in our orientation and fundamental foreign policy principles.
On the
other hand, it is worth taking a closer look at latest events. In order to
properly analyse recent developments, we must put things in context: In a
nutshell, one beautiful summer night, Turkey went through a nightmare, a failed
coup d’etat attempt on 15 July, organized by FETÖ (the Fethullahist Terrorist
Organization). In the troubles 246 citizens died and 2185 were wounded. There
was an attempt on the life of President Erdoğan. The Turkish Parliament with
the MP’s inside, the Presidential Palace and other institutions were bombed by
hi-jacked military aircraft and fired upon by helicopters and tanks, by the
putchists. The coup was averted mainly because the Turkish people took to the
streets and stood up for their democracy and rule of law. All opposition
parties in Parliament, squabbling before the coup attempt gave unequivocal
support to our elected President and the government during and after the coup
attempt. A state of emergency was declared for 3 months and now we are picking
up the pieces.
With
these facts in mind, I would define the failed coup on 15 July as BC in recent
Turkish politics (in the sense of “Before and after the Coup”). We must all
question previous cliches and wake up to a new democratic reality and unity in
Turkey. Indeed, the Turkish people and all the opposition Parties are united,
much different from before, as we saw in the 7 August Democracy Rally in
Istanbul, with the participation of 4 million in Yenikapı and around 10
million, synchronously participating in other cities, watching the speeches
through large screens. This was the largest political gathering Istanbul has
ever seen, perhaps the largest one in the world. It was a sterling performance
for the Turkish Democracy. I believe that all democracy loving countries,
including ofcourse our important neighbour Greece, should be pleased with this
positive development and give us support, as they indeed do.
I would
say that the ones that were after an “authoritarianism and abuse of power” are
those who attempted the coup and conducted serious crimes on 15 July.
On the
other hand, our President was quite vocal in reaching out and referring to some
past choices as mistakes, asking for forgiveness from the Turkish people. A
self-criticism you do not find even in countries that are generally accepted as
advanced democracies, let alone authoritarian ones. In face of the coup d’etat,
all opposition parties in Parliament gave unanimous support for the
establishment of a joint investigation committee. They also signed a joint
statement against the coup. At the same time, not only all opposition parties,
but also the Turkish people gave unequivocal support to our elected
president and government in its recent actions. They are continuing to do so,
as we see in “democracy watch” rallies held every night, all across Turkey,
since the failed coup attempt. This does not look like an authoritarian rule to
me.
I also
beg to differ with your comment on “...Islamic and nationalistic frenzy...”.
The Turkish people are no doubt patriotic, as we saw them recently lying in
front of and jumping upon tanks when there was a sudden threat to their
democracy and way of life. But I would not define this as “nationalistic
frenzy”. As you should also very well know, the Turkish Anatolian
interpretation of Islam is a benign and tolerant one. There may be pockets of
fundamentalism in any country, but we combat extremism and any false interpretation
of our religion, as we are indeed an active part of the coalition against
DEASH. Therefore, I find such generalizations not just off the mark, but
dangerous in the sense that they lead to Islamophobia.
As for
the reaction of the West; the general perception in Turkey is one of
frustration and disappointment. Although there was widespread support for our
struggle against the coup attempt, we were disappointed that Western
leaders have been quite slow in visiting Turkey and were not vocal enough. This
perception is also valid for the Western press in general. As the Ambassador in
Athens, I must add however, that the Greek leadership was an exception to this
general picture, as we were given strong support at all levels, as events were
yet unfolding.
A
noteworthy development is that the Turkish economy is chugging along as well as
ever. This is also an indication of our national solidarity. The Turkish people
bought 9 billion Dolars worth of Turkish Lira in the first week after the coup
attempt, in a strong display of patriotism. Our first half growth in this year
will still be %4.
Question: There is a widespread belief that voices opposing the government, including
many journalists, are being silenced by force, and that the rule of law is
being violated.
Answer: These
claims and concerns are unfounded. The emergency law powers are used very
carefully. A meticulous cleaning-up process is going on against FETÖ. This
process naturally does include some journalists, newspapers and tv stations,
but this can not be defined as “silencing the opposition”. The journalists and
institutions in question are those who were part of this terrorist
organization.
In
Turkey today, everyone is aware of the important role the press played on 15
July and we treasure our freedom of press very dearly. In fact, it is due to
the strong freedom of press that the coup was averted in the first place. The
turning point was when President Erdoğan appeared live, through face-time on
Turkish TV and called on the people to take to the streets, resist the coup and
uphold democracy.
Regarding
FETÖ militants, all investigations and court cases are conducted transparently,
based on solid evidence and fully respecting human rights, in accordance with
international norms. Indeed, all developments are closely followed by
opposition parties and democratic institutions. There have been no considerable
complaints that state of emergency powers are misused. It is also best to keep
in mind that all proceedings are in any event subject to judicial review, both
at domestic and international level.
Actually,
there is now abundant evidence that our legal system and country have suffered
for some time from the manipulations and infiltration of the FETÖ prosecutors
and judges. These militants who exploited their important positions are now
being removed, as new evidence is emerging by the day. In this process, many
important unsolved cases are also coming to light. This process should be
supported by everyone respecting democracy and the rule of law.
We are
realizing as a nation that some recent mass court cases (such as Balyoz,
Ergenekon, Oda TV etc) which were built on shoddy and fabricated evidence were
used effectively to get rid of competent high officials and push FETÖ militants
up in the ranks of all institutions of the state. It is very clear to anyone
following Turkey closely that the measures taken today will result in a much
healthier and transparent legal system, solidly based on the rule of law.
Question: Will Turkey continue implementing the agreement with the EU on the refugee
issue?
Answer: Turkey
is determined to continue implementing the refugee agreement with the EU. We
have fulfilled our part of the deal since day one. We are now expecting the EU
to fulfill its side of the deal, namely visa liberalization, financial support
and controlled repatriation. We have readmitted all of the persons for whom the
Greek authorities sent a request. This is a total of 468 people. There are
three more operations planned on 17 August. It would also be helpful if returns
from Greece are speeded up, in order to prove that the system is working. We
are cooperating and coordinating effectively with our Greek colleagues on its
implementation. I think it is not fair to expect only one side to keep its
promises with regard to Turkey-EU agreement. I strongly believe that the
agreement was an important success and must be honored by all sides.
Question: What is the state of relations with Greece, in the aftermath of the failed coup
attempt ?
Answer: Our
relations are very good and stable, as always. I believe we mutually have a
very good understanding of each other’s positions on various issues. Minister
Çavuşoğlu expressedly thanked the Greek government for their support after the
failed coup, in an interview on Turkish TV, on 5 August.
Question: Independent of potential developments in the EU-Turkey front, would Ankara work
on a bilateral agreement with Greece - which is an honest supporter of her
European path - on the refugees ?
Answer: We
already have a well functioning bilateral protocol signed between Turkey and
Greece in 2001, long before the finalization of a readmission agreement between
Turkey and the EU. Maybe it is not so visible in the shadow of the current
emphasis on the islands, but according to this bilateral protocol of 2001,
since the beginning of 2016, 1.098 irregular migrants have already been
readmitted to Turkey from the İpsala-Koipoi border. This means that the
bilateral protocol is actually working better than the Turkey-EU one. We are of
course in close contact with Greek authorities at all levels and the bilateral
implementation protocol of the Turkey-EU Readmission Agreement is also underway
between our two countries.
Question: Would a meeting between the leaders of the two countries prove useful ?
Answer: Our
leaders meet regularly at every level, including in the margins of
international meetings. Naturally bilateral contacts are always useful and we
are working on them as much as the busy schedules of our leaders permit.
Question: Is
Turkey prepared to accept the termination of the anachronistic security
guarantees in Cyprus, a move that would facilitate a solution ?
Answer: Turkey
strongly supports a solution in Cyprus. However, I would not define security
guarantees as anachronistic. We are all witnessing for the last decades a
series of security problems in Europe, the Middle East and North Africa, all
close to, or actually in the Mediterranean basin. It is obvious that human
nature has not yet evolved to a point where we can afford to not take security
measures. The rise of the extreme right in the latest elections in South Cyprus
is also a source of concern to us.
On the
other hand, I would not define the 1960 Treaties that established the Republic
of Cyprus as sacred texts either. We can and should revisit all aspects of the
Cyprus question in a fresh light and with an open vision, including the
security and guarantees aspect.
As in
every negotiation process, it is important for all interested parties to agree
on relevant aspects with their free will and be fully satisfied with the
outcome. This of course does not mean that each side would get %100 of what
they want. Such an expectation would be contrary to the nature of any
negotiation process. So there is bound to be give and take.
With
this in mind, I must emphasize that the Turkish Cypriots being numerically
fewer on the Island feel insecure and that there is near-consensus on the
importance of Turkey’s continued guarantee and provision of security, at least
for the Turkish Cypriots. We also understand that the Greek Cypriots have their
own concerns. Both communities have bitter experiences for different reasons,
regarding the near past. We must find ways to satisfy both these sets of
concerns. In that spirit, Turkey is determined to contribute to the indigenous
negotiation process with a constructive approach and an open mind.
Question: President Erdogan has been very critical of the US. Some in Ankara are
suggesting Washington might have supported the coup attempt.
Answer: I would describe President Erdoğan’s comments
as realistic, rather than critical. As for the speculation of “some in Ankara”,
I do not want to comment on conspiracy theories.
In various statements, President Erdoğan
emphasized that Turkey, which is a strategic ally of the US, faced an attempt
to overthrow the freely elected government, yet, the show of solidarity came
rather later than expected. He stated that the US Secretary of State, for
example, planned to visit Turkey on August 24, in other words, 45 days after
the coup attempt. President Erdoğan also expressed his desire for US officials
to come up with stronger words. It does not help much that the leader of FETÖ
is residing in Pennsylvania… This being the case, the US is Turkey’s most
important ally and will remain so. We have a strong and multi-faceted
relationship and we all strongly believe that we will overcome any
misunderstandings quite soon.
Question: The
role of Gülen, and the next steps if the US does not extradite him?
Answer: There is
no doubt Mr. Gülen is behind the failed coup d’etat in Turkey. The State was
gathering evidence on FETÖ for quite some time. However, what did come as a
surprise to many, was how far Gülen and the FETÖ terrorist organization he is
heading can go in its criminal activities, including firing upon unarmed
civilians. I understand abundant evidence is being given to US authorities and
that contacts are continuing. It is our strong expectation that he must be
extradited to Turkey, to face justice. The US is our important Ally and I am
confident that we will see a reasonable solution to the issue at hand.
Question: On different occasions, officials and analysts from the US, European countries,
and Russia, have criticized Turkey for supporting ISIS. Is it their imagination
?
Answer: The assumption that Turkey supports DEASH is completely
false. Turkey is an active and crucial player in the fight against this
terrorist organization. We have been a member of the International Coalition to
Counter DEASH since its inception. We have mobilized our resources for its
success. Turkey has opened up its bases to Coalition aircraft. We have also
been conducting comprehensive operations against this terrorist organization
through our own means. Turkey is not immune from DEASH terror either. This
organization is responsible for grave terrorist acts that led to the loss of
life in Turkey. It is a primitive organization which distorts the peaceful
teachings of our religion and is certainly not worthy of the name it gives
itself. We are determined to continue our support in combatting the DEASH
terrorist organization, with strong international support and coordination.
Indeed it is our bedrock principle that we can not and must not differentiate
between terrorist organizations. There is no such thing as a benign terrorist
organization or “my terrorist” “your terrorist”. All terrorists are a threat to
humanity and the peaceful international order and must be treated accordingly.
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